Episode #19: The Capitalist States of America - Brutality of U.S. Elites, Abroad and at Home (Part Two)
Propaganda's Role in U.S. Immigration and Wealth Redistribution
In this episode of 'Propaganda Loves You,' host Joe and co-hosts Kodie and Arthur delve into the controversial practices of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) as highlighted in a column by Amy Goodman and Dennis Moynihan. The discussion covers ICE's violent tactics, the economic exploitation of undocumented immigrants, and the financial gains of private corporations like the Geo Group and Palantir amidst mass deportations. They explore the historical context of ICE, its budget growth, and the political implications of challenging such institutions. The conversation branches into the influence of Edward Bernays on consumer culture, the problematic aspects of state versus federal rights, and recent Supreme Court decisions impacting Medicaid and reproductive rights. The team also shares satirical commentary and updates on local political campaigns, encouraging civic engagement and critical thinking.
00:00 Introduction and Episode Context
00:21 Welcome to Propaganda Loves You
01:03 Abuses at Home: ICE and Wealth Redistribution
02:05 The Case of Narciso Barranca
03:43 Trump's Immigration Policies and Economic Impact
05:44 Resistance and Legal Battles
07:30 ICE's Budget and Political Implications
10:31 Institutional Growth and Critique
14:47 Historical Perspective on Government Growth
16:34 Graywater Securities and Tech Executives
21:04 The Manhattan Project and Ethical Implications
24:46 The Illusion of Control and Money
26:02 Exploring Edward Bernays and Modern Propaganda
32:24 The Impact of Supreme Court Decisions on Freedom
45:38 Satire and Its Subtle Power
46:47 Encouragement to Get Involved in Politics
48:20 Positive News and Final Thoughts
https://www.democracynow.org/2025/6/26/time_to_unmask_trumps_detention_and
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/jun/26/supreme-court-planned-parenthood-decision
https://forward.com/fast-forward/732850/report-israeli-soldiers-say-they-are-ordered-to-shoot-at-unarmed-gazans-seeking-aid/
https://www.commondreams.org/news/idf-gaza-aid-killings
https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-confirms-probe-into-killings-near-gaza-aid-site-denies-troops-ordered-to-shoot-civilians/
https://www.uniladtech.com/news/ai/email-sam-altman-elon-musk-manhattan-project-ai-643251-20250228
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLktPdpPFKHfoXRfTPOwyR8SG8EHLWOSj6
Transcript
Hey everyone, we did a two parter this week, so if you are just jumping into episode 19 without listening to episode 18, the beginning might not make a ton of sense.
Speaker A:So I would suggest going back and at least listening to the first part of episode 18 to understand the topics we're going to jump into.
Speaker A:But you'd still probably be able to understand where we're going with this.
Speaker A:So your call.
Speaker A:All right, here's the episode.
Speaker B:Welcome to Propaganda.
Speaker B:Love you.
Speaker B:The show that asks and answers the question, whose country is this anyway?
Speaker B:I'm Joe, your host for this week and I'm joined by Cody and Arthur.
Speaker B:Ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country.
Speaker B:We shall fight on the beaches.
Speaker C:We shall fight on the sandy grounds.
Speaker B:Mr.
Speaker B:Gorbachev, tear down this wal.
Speaker A:Are.
Speaker B:We ready for our next cheerful topic for today?
Speaker B:The second category was Abuses at Home.
Speaker B:And I've read from Democracy now before News Organization I like a lot.
Speaker B:And Amy Goodman and Dennis Moynihan have a nice column this week that came out two days ago called Time to Unmask Trump's Detention and Deportation Squads.
Speaker B:So actually this is categories 2 and 3 in this article.
Speaker B:The third category was wealth redistribution upward.
Speaker B:The second one was Abuses at Home.
Speaker B:So I'm going to read their column from Democracy Now, Amy Goodman and Dennis Moynihan.
Speaker B:And as I'm reading, just maybe have these two categories in the back of your mind.
Speaker B:How is the abuse that's being perpetrated on people within the country connected to wealth redistribution upward to the ruling class?
Speaker B:So just a question for us to think about and talk about.
Speaker B:I'm gonna say some Latin names that I may pronounce incorrectly.
Speaker B:I apologize if I get the pronounce pronunciation wrong.
Speaker B:With each passing day, the violence wielded by ICE U.S.
Speaker B:immigration and Customs Enforcement grows more intense and widespread.
Speaker B:One grotesquely emblematic example of this was the recent violent arrest of 48 year old narrative Narquiso Barranca in Santa Ana, California.
Speaker B:Narquiso, a hardworking immigrant laborer who came from Mexico over 30 years ago, is the father of three U.S.
Speaker B:marines.
Speaker B:While landscaping outside an IHOP restaurant on June 21, he was assaulted by at least seven armed masked men who tackled him and repeatedly punched him in the head.
Speaker B:They handcuffed him and shoved him into an unmarked suv.
Speaker B:The plainclothes agents wore face masks, bulletproof vests, and military grade helmets.
Speaker B:Some of the vests read Police U.S.
Speaker B:border Patrol on the back.
Speaker B:But to anyone confronted by these gangs, no identifying marks, names or badges were visible.
Speaker B:One of Narquiso's sons, Alejandro Barranca, a US Marine Corps veteran, was able to visit his father in jail.
Speaker B:Narquiso was still wearing the same work clothes that were bloodied in the assault.
Speaker B:His son said in an interview with Democracy now, quote, he looked beat up, he looked rough, he looked defeated, he was sad.
Speaker B:Anyone would be scared if they see these guys come up to them masked, not in uniform, guns out, unquote.
Speaker B:City of Santa Ana Council member Jonathan Hernandez, also on Democracy now, added, quote, we are watching violence unfold racial profiling increase in cities like Santa Ana where 41% of our residents are migrants, 70% are of Latino descent.
Speaker B:Agents come into our community and they're refusing to identify themselves.
Speaker B:They don't have judicial warrants and these ICE raids are an example of the government's overreach, unquote.
Speaker B:In mid June, President Trump briefly paused immigration raids on farms, hotels and restaurants, ostensibly to ensure these key industries have supported him in the past.
Speaker B:Continue to do so, Trump said, quote, our our great farmers and people in the hotel and leisure business have been stating that our very aggressive policy on immigration is taking very good longtime workers away from them, with those jobs being almost impossible to replace, unquote.
Speaker B:Soon after he reversed himself, the short pause revealed a fundamental truth about undocumented immigrants.
Speaker B:The US Economy doesn't function without them.
Speaker B:Nevertheless, urged on by White House Deputy Chief of Staff Stephen Miller, ice, Homeland Security and border agents are snatching and deporting the very workers on whom our economy depends.
Speaker B:There are some sectors of the private economy that are thriving amidst the mass deportations.
Speaker B:Geo Group, the private prison corporation, has seen its stock rise by over 50% since Trump's election.
Speaker B:Palantir, the tech and AI firm co founded by Trump backer billionaire Peter Thiel, has seen its stock rise over 500% in the last year.
Speaker B:It was recently reported that Palantir is building tools to allow near real time tracking of immigrants in the U.S.
Speaker B:the Program on Government Oversight, or POGO, reported that Stephen Miller's financial disclosure reveals he owns up to $250,000 in Palantir stock.
Speaker B:Meanwhile, the Republican majority on the US Supreme Court has handed Trump a deportation related victory.
Speaker B:Several immigrants sued the government to stop or reverse deportations to Guatemala, South Sudan and Libya.
Speaker B:A federal judge in Massachusetts issued an injunction against these so called third party nation removals this week.
Speaker B:The Supreme Court's six conservative justices overturned that injunction without comment.
Speaker B:Justices Sonia Sotomayor, Elena Kagan and Ketanji Brown Jackson dissented, writing that the Trump administration's flagrantly unlawful conduct, backed by the Supreme Court, is exposing thousands to the risk of torture or death, unquote.
Speaker B:Resistance is active, growing, and making a difference.
Speaker B:Grassroots pressure and legal battles have won the release of international students targeted for their solidarity with Palestinians, among them Rumesa Ozturk, Mohsen Madawi, and the first such student arrested and threatened with deportation, Mahmoud Khalid.
Speaker B:Likewise, grassroots legal and congressional pressure forced the Trump administration to bring Gilmar Albergo Garcia back to the United States.
Speaker B: during Trump's first term in: Speaker B:Then, this past March 12, he was snatched from a parking lot and sent against a court order to El Salvador.
Speaker B:Under enormous legal and grassroots pressure, the federal government finally returned Abrego Garcia to the U.S.
Speaker B:despite that victory, upon his return, the federal government promptly re arrested him, charging him with human trafficking for allegedly driving undocumented immigrants several years ago.
Speaker B:He remains in federal custody in Tennessee, and if released, ICE will likely attempt to deport him.
Speaker B:Meanwhile, Narquiso Barranca sits in ICE detention with his two sons still on active duty in the US Marines.
Speaker B:Not far away at Fort Pendleton.
Speaker B:It is past time to unmask the violent agents targeting people like Narquiso and halt Trump's racist, xenophobic mass detentions and deportations.
Speaker B:So that is the Democracy now column for this week, and I thought it touched on a lot of the topics that we've been covering lately in our recent issue, recent episodes, and I know we've talked at length about Kilmor Abrego Garcia's case in particular, but I thought just with all the different points that they hit on in that article, there's a lot for us to work with there.
Speaker B: vernment agency that began in: Speaker B:It is younger than the hit Pixar movie Shrek.
Speaker B: an ice, and since it began in: Speaker B:Bush administration, its budget has consistently gone up through Democratic and Republican administrations.
Speaker B:It started at like 3.5 billion, and now it's like somewhere around 9 or 10 billion a year.
Speaker B:And so if both of our parties in this country are committed to funding this insane organization with our money, what can we do about that politically?
Speaker B:Is there anything we can meaningfully do about ice?
Speaker C:Abolish ICE immediately.
Speaker C:I think we got to Challenge all centrist Democrats in the upcoming midterm elections and try to push for abolishing ice because it's like a federal terror apparatus.
Speaker C:And the whole call for, like, taking off their masks and having accountability, it's not like it's falling on deaf ears.
Speaker C:They hear it and they know it.
Speaker C:They're rejecting it.
Speaker C:And in lieu of that, Trump's tweeting out like, oh, it's time for the protesters to take off their masks.
Speaker C:So it's pretty disgusting.
Speaker C:And the whole videos of, like, them using this militarization of, like.
Speaker C:Is it C4?
Speaker C:What's the door with the.
Speaker C:That they blew?
Speaker A:Oh, the shape charts that they use.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, that.
Speaker A:I don't know if it's like, C4 or what that is made of.
Speaker C:It's just plastic grotesque.
Speaker C:And it highlights.
Speaker C:Joe, like, what you're talking about, about, like, who's profiting off this stuff.
Speaker C:It's like, there's more int.
Speaker C:Like, what do they call it?
Speaker C:Like, just militarization of police.
Speaker C:And there's, I'm sure, like, the headcount for each person that they get inside each facility is just, like, more demand for more money.
Speaker C:And then they exploit the labor of these people.
Speaker C:And then there's, like, bonds and, like, the whole prison and, like, complex thing.
Speaker C:It's just a whole wealth.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Wealth upward might trickle down one day, though.
Speaker C:Hillary Clinton says it might.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it's like, I'm glad you mentioned that, because it's so important to remember that the 13th amendment gives legal constitutional coverage for turning any incarcerated person effectively into a slave.
Speaker B:Like, regardless of due process, once they arrest a person and put them under the legal auspices of, you know, this person committed a crime, they're arrested, they can be a slave.
Speaker B:You can force them to do labor under the 13th Amendment.
Speaker B:And there's a reason why we have the largest, by far largest prison population of any country on the planet, as a per capita whatever, you know, 25% of the world's prisoners in this country, only 5% of the world population.
Speaker B:It's vastly out of proportion with what it should be.
Speaker B:Even if you believe in incarceration as, like, a meaningful institution.
Speaker B:The other thing I was going to say is about, like, the history of ice.
Speaker B:I mean, to me, ice, the timing of ICE in the middle of Bush's first term and, you know, all the heightened rhetoric about the war on terror and everything like that, it seems connected to that in a big way.
Speaker B:One of the things we talked about a lot in grad school when we were Critiquing institutions from a historical perspective is that the institution takes on an identity of its own.
Speaker B:You have the individual people who work there, which you can say whatever you want about, but the institution itself has this self perpetuating drive.
Speaker B:The institution wants to reproduce itself.
Speaker B:So once it's set up, it wants to grow, it wants to extend its influence.
Speaker B:Regardless of whether you agree with its mission or not, the institution is going to try to grow.
Speaker B:And you see the same thing with universities as institutions.
Speaker B:You can see tuition skyrocketing year after year, administrative roles getting bigger and bigger, checks professors getting smaller and smaller.
Speaker B:You can see the same thing happening in any kind of institution, whether it's military, academic, whatever.
Speaker B:The institution will take on a life of its own and try to grow and grow and grow.
Speaker B:And yeah, looking at it from that perspective, you have to stop and ask.
Speaker B:And I come to the same conclusion as you, Arthur.
Speaker B:Like bad institution, it needs to go abolish ice, right?
Speaker B:Let's take that money and put it somewhere else.
Speaker B:Like homelessness, for example.
Speaker B:Why do we have between 500,000 and a million people unhoused every year in this country when we have seven?
Speaker B:What was the number?
Speaker B:783 billionaires or whatever that specific number was.
Speaker B:There's money here that can easily be used to make lives better for people who are suffering.
Speaker B:But again, whose country is this anyway?
Speaker B:Are we sure it's ours as in the people or is there a small club that we're not invited to join?
Speaker B:Then it's actually their country and we're just living in it.
Speaker A:I was just looking up some of the history on ICE and yeah, completely agree with you.
Speaker A:It was formed after September 11 along with the Department of Homeland Security when that actually came together, merging of Immigration and Nationalization Services and United States Custom Service and pulled into this one organization, ice.
Speaker A:But I did want to mention to your point too about organizations just growing.
Speaker A:Like yeah, and I that saw that constantly, right?
Speaker A:You'd have an organization that stands up for this little specific niche, mission like thing.
Speaker A:And before you know it, it's like, well, we need $20 million.
Speaker A:And you know, and what that usually happens is because like, well now we need to spend X amount and then they're looking for more mission, right?
Speaker A:Like it's mission creep is what people call it.
Speaker A:So it's always like, oh, like I know I'm supposed to be focused on this very specific thing, but if I use my technology for this, right?
Speaker A:Like then I can get into this space and then I get more money.
Speaker A:I get more funding, my organization grows.
Speaker A:So I constantly saw that.
Speaker A:And it's not effective just taking a step back from ICE in general, but it's just not effective use of taxpayer dollars either because it just creates this competition inside government to continue growing and getting the same mission that other people have.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Like just outside the context of ICE in general.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:That's a.
Speaker A:It's an issue for sure.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:How many times have you heard leaders, when they're talking about the budget, mention something to the effect that we got this leftover chunk in the budget, end of the quarter's coming up.
Speaker B:If we don't use it, they're going to reduce our budget.
Speaker B:So, you know, we got to use it and justify it so we get it again next year.
Speaker B:And it's part of the same thing.
Speaker B:Like, no.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And it's funny you mentioned, like, the organization, like, takes on its own because it's not like for some of a lot of those government organizations that have like multiple leaders going through.
Speaker A:It's not like necessarily they have consistent leadership that's always like, I want this to grow, but it's just like a mindset thing.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Of everyone that comes in.
Speaker A:They know they have to spend.
Speaker A:They know they have to, like, they want to leave their mark on this organization.
Speaker A:No one wants to be the guy that shuts down an organization, except for pretty much like everybody that's in government right now.
Speaker A:I guess everyone wants to shut everything down.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But ye.
Speaker A:Yeah, so it's like it is.
Speaker A:That org itself is weird when it grows and when it takes on mission, it does take on its own culture.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:I guess is what I'm saying.
Speaker A:Like, the people come and go, but that org is going to continue to morph.
Speaker B:Yeah, for sure.
Speaker B:And just as like a thought experiment for a second, let's zoom out historically and think about the same idea and apply it to the US government.
Speaker B: know, let's say it's the year: Speaker B:First of all, there's 13 colonies on the east coast.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:They're all separate entities.
Speaker B:But all of a sudden, these group of elites get together and they say, no, no, no, no, let's make it one thing.
Speaker B:Let's have one organization that controls all 13 colonies.
Speaker B:Let's convince everyone to get in line with it and defend it, and let's start this war with Britain so we can do our own thing.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:That starts as one organization that controls the east coast of North America and then just slide the scale of time to now and watch this small organization eat the whole continent coast.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Just in terms of mission creep or an organization that wants to reproduce itself.
Speaker B:I try to look at the US government this way as that kind of organization that wants to keep perpetuating itself.
Speaker B:And so, yeah, I fully agree with everything about, you know, how horrible Trump is and all the terrible policies he's putting into place and how actually dangerous his administration is.
Speaker B:That's like a big, nasty pimple on the nose of the actual organization itself.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:And I'm trying to look at the whole organization and can we repurpose it to better means or is there something else we need to do?
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:How do you stop that continual growth mindset?
Speaker A:Like, how do you get people to be like, this is enough, we're okay, we're okay here.
Speaker A:We could even go back a little bit.
Speaker B:Word.
Speaker B:I'm trying to think of, I think it's like some ism.
Speaker B:Ism to do with community.
Speaker B:What's it called?
Speaker B:Oh, oh, it's a Communism.
Speaker B:I think that's what.
Speaker B:I'm touched.
Speaker A:We now take you live to the White House press briefing room.
Speaker B:Secretary Levi, can you comment on the.
Speaker C:Growing concerns around Gray Water Security's domestic deployments?
Speaker C:Specifically reports of their involvement in managing protests in US cities.
Speaker B:Thank you for the question.
Speaker B:Greywater operates under legally flexible contractor frameworks.
Speaker B:When local authorities request assistance in maintaining civic flow, Greywater provides structure, presence and deterrence.
Speaker C:But those aren't war zones.
Speaker C:Those are high schools, public parks, labor rallies.
Speaker B:Which is exactly why discipline matters.
Speaker B:Greywater doesn't escalate.
Speaker B:They resolve their integration with fortune.
Speaker B:Foresight ensures action is grounded in data, not reaction.
Speaker B:These aren't combat operations.
Speaker B:They're stability engagements.
Speaker C:Isn't that a violation of constitutional protections?
Speaker B:If those people wanted constitutional protections, they should have complied.
Speaker B:I had noticed in the news cycle that tech executives were direct, commissioned as lieutenant colonels, um, and sort of a mask off moment, ironically, with ice and all their masks on, tech executives are like, yeah, we're the government now.
Speaker A:Yeah, I did see that.
Speaker A:And I think they were trying to compare it to essentially the Manhattan Project, where it was like the race for the nuclear bomb.
Speaker A:And now they're saying it's like the Manhattan Project, but the race for AI, which in general, like, I don't necessarily think that there shouldn't be some sort of government led thing here, but with regulation over it or some sort of more oversight into like, what's actually occurring.
Speaker A:But the problem I see with it too.
Speaker A:Because this did happen, right, for the Manhattan Project, like they took a bunch of academics, like Oppenheimer was one of them.
Speaker A:They direct commissioned them into the military.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:So there's precedent for that happening.
Speaker A:But the thing was, that was at the request of the government.
Speaker A:And this seems more like a corporate.
Speaker A:And so actually two distinctions I want to make.
Speaker A:One that was taking professors and people from academic institutions that were considered experts in their field and bringing them onto this, like the Manhattan Project, to try and create the nuclear bomb at the behest of the government.
Speaker A:What's occurring here is you have a bunch of tech executives and organizations like OpenAI.
Speaker A:I think Sam Altman said this himself was like, we need to create a Manhattan like project, but for AI.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And so it's not the government that said, like, we should do this.
Speaker A:It was like formulated and thought of from those AI corporations, right, that are actually pushing to try to create this.
Speaker A:And so it's like the opposite, right, where corporate America is saying we need to create a type of Manhattan Project.
Speaker A:And then the government is now pulling people in from these organizations and direct commissioning them.
Speaker A:So I think there's some differences there between those two things that we could probably point out.
Speaker A:But yeah, it's concerning, I would say, especially with, you know, Palantir being just thrown up as like the corporate sponsor for everything these days for the US Government.
Speaker A:They're trying to like, connect those two things right there.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's not good.
Speaker A:Not good.
Speaker C:Yeah, it's like I.
Speaker C:It wasn't.
Speaker C:Palantir isn't deal like the.
Speaker C:I mean, you know, spearheading this whole Silicon Valley like fractionalism.
Speaker C:We're all in charge of our local cities.
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:It's just like capitalism is protecting itself, like its capital in this.
Speaker C:You know, there's raw materials and then there's the digital age.
Speaker C:And it's pressing forward in that and it's just going to lead to more militarization tech, I'm sure.
Speaker C:And like the policing of people and mass control.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:I mean, if you've read or watched the Lord of the Rings, Palantir is the little scary fireball that Sauron can see everything through.
Speaker B:And they're not even trying to hide their intentions.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:It's mass surveillance.
Speaker B:Especially right now in the context of all of these racist deportations.
Speaker B:The more they can surveil and track people that they want to enslave or kick out or abuse or whatever, the better.
Speaker B:So that's what they're doing.
Speaker B:And the Whole Manhattan Project thing, like, we don't have to get into all that necessarily.
Speaker B:But I also think that was a huge, huge mistake.
Speaker B:A huge.
Speaker B:Not even a mistake, like, just pure un.
Speaker B:You talk about terrorism, you're vaporizing civilian city populations with a bomb when you've already won the war.
Speaker B:There was no need to drop the bombs.
Speaker B:Two of them on civilian populations in Japan.
Speaker B:And Howard Zinn, in A People's History of the United States, has a lot to say about this event in history.
Speaker B:How I think it was Nagasaki.
Speaker B:Not Hiroshima, but Nagasaki.
Speaker B:US The.
Speaker B:The military got intel, credible intel, before they dropped the bomb that there were US military POWs in Nagasaki.
Speaker B:And the message that the people dropping the bomb got back after that was, plans need to proceed as scheduled.
Speaker B:No change in plans.
Speaker B:Drop the bomb.
Speaker B:So they knew, regardless of what you think about Japanese civilians being vaporized, even US POW is knowingly there.
Speaker B:They were like, yeah, go ahead, drop it.
Speaker B:We don't care.
Speaker B:There was no strategic purpose to drop the bombs.
Speaker B:You didn't need to.
Speaker B:We're the only country in the history of the world who has dropped nuclear weapons on civilians.
Speaker B:Maybe other countries have tested them.
Speaker B:I don't know about that.
Speaker B:But we're the only ones who've ever used them.
Speaker B:So talk about terrorism.
Speaker B:If there's anything that counts as terrorism.
Speaker B:I mean, come on.
Speaker B:Correct.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And, you know, I think we talked about this in one of the early episodes with.
Speaker A:Where you.
Speaker A:Where you were talking about.
Speaker A:Maybe it was Howard Zinn.
Speaker A:So, like, the book American Prometheus that talks all about Oppenheimer, and that's like, a biography that actually was.
Speaker A:I think it was the biography that was used as, like, the basis for the movie Oppenheimer that came out recently.
Speaker A:But a lot of that is in there in one of the later chapters, basically, like, there was a lot of conflict back and forth, like, okay, well, we've developed this thing, but, you know, the war is over in Germany, and, like, we're hearing that Japan is ready to come to the table.
Speaker A:So, like, why are we doing this sort of thing?
Speaker A:And it was like.
Speaker A:It kind of talked about that for, like, one of the chapters.
Speaker A:But the thing is, like, that's, like, one little part of the book, and it's like this massive ode to Oppenheimer.
Speaker A:And, you know, it does go into, like, his conflict on that and whatnot.
Speaker A:I mean, it's.
Speaker A:It's a fascinating read anyway, regardless.
Speaker A:But it just made me think about that point from Howard Zinn.
Speaker A:Like, you can mention it.
Speaker A:You can talk about it.
Speaker A:But, like, where's the emphasis put on this.
Speaker A:This thing?
Speaker A:It's immortalizing that, you know, as a great achievement, basically.
Speaker A:And we went from ice to Oppenheimer.
Speaker A:But I guess getting back to that original article there and Palantir, I think one of your questions, Joe, was like, how is this showing money being.
Speaker A:Going from, like, the wealth transfer from lower class up and just like in there, it's what it's saying.
Speaker A:It's like Stephen Miller, right, having stock in Palantir and like, these people having shares in the private prison industries that are, like, booming right now.
Speaker C:Yeah, I was gonna nerd out about.
Speaker C:I've read Lord of the Rings and Silmarillion a few times.
Speaker C:And Palantir, it's a really interesting name because the Palantir.
Speaker C:Yeah, there's like these orbs created by the Valinor gods, given to, like, the Lords of Numenor.
Speaker C:And they, like, you know, they can communicate across the world and they can even, like, do some weird time stuff.
Speaker C:But if some powerful entity like Sauron wants to manipulate it, you know, you could totally distort what people see.
Speaker C:And so it's like totally the exact same thing where it's like Patrick Thiel does surveillance software, and he literally can, like, control the narrative of the world through it.
Speaker C:So it's like, regardless of how much money these people have, it's almost like a distraction, the number of money.
Speaker C:It's like they control everything.
Speaker C:They control all of the resources, they control all of the technology and all of the surveillance.
Speaker C:The money is like a joke to them.
Speaker C:It doesn't even matter.
Speaker C:It's just a fictitious number.
Speaker C:So we should tax it more aggressively.
Speaker B:Should seize the means of production.
Speaker B:Might want to edit that line out.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:I'm fine with it, but.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker B:I mean, it's.
Speaker B:I have a lot of thoughts all at once, but I don't want to take up a ton of time rambling with random things.
Speaker B:But just money and the way it rationalizes the material world in a way that we think we need money in order.
Speaker B:You know what?
Speaker B:Like, comedians have made this point before, before we invented money and all these systems of economic control, like food just grew.
Speaker B:It's like on.
Speaker B:Just walk around.
Speaker B:Food is out there.
Speaker B:It's on the trees, on the floor.
Speaker B:You can hunt, you can fish, you can pick vegetables and fruits.
Speaker B:You can build little huts.
Speaker B:Like, you can.
Speaker B:You can live.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:I'm not making a very articulate point, but money as a means of controlling People is something to explore here.
Speaker A:I was going to bring this up later, but I think it ties directly into all of this kind of conversation.
Speaker A:Have you guys heard about Edward Bernays?
Speaker A:When I first started talking about doing this podcast, I was talking to somebody about it and they said, are you going to cover Edward Bernays?
Speaker A:And I was like, I don't know who that is.
Speaker A:They were like, well, you should definitely look into it because it's like essentially the father of US propaganda.
Speaker A:I was like, okay, that's interesting.
Speaker A:Like, and I was like looking at this more from like the disinformation kind of Russian Soviet propaganda angle was really kind of how I started looking at all of this.
Speaker A:But Bernay is like, we're gonna have to do probably a series on him.
Speaker A:But the, the short version and the reason I bring it up is he, he's essentially the guy that started modern advertising and the way that we look at consumer culture in America and the way that America kind of blew up after World War II from the fact that we had learned how to do the wartime manufacturing.
Speaker A:But then like, okay, where all these things go that we're producing so much of and it's like, well, we need to figure out a way to make people want to have more than one shirt.
Speaker A:Or like they need to buy another pair of shoes even though one their shares that they're working, they have right now are fine.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Like, so it's like how do we convince people to go from a needs based society to a wants based society?
Speaker A:And this is the guy that basically, basically did that and came up with that.
Speaker A:And so it's, it's interesting because he, before World War II, he was also, he, he kind of started all the advertising that helped lead to the, the first stock market crash in the first place.
Speaker A:His whole history is basically convince the American public to enter World War I, help with the advertising industry to lead to the initial stock market crash, do all of the propaganda for the US into World War II and like work with the US government on how they're doing that, that style of propaganda.
Speaker A:And then when he got back from like doing World War II stuff, it was like, well, that worked there.
Speaker A:So how do we use this in, in the United States?
Speaker A:It's like, well you can't call it propaganda, so we'll call it public relations.
Speaker A:And he's basically the guy that started public relations in the United States and modern advertising and used all the tactics and techniques that they use for wartime propaganda.
Speaker A:He's also the guy that Goebbels Based a lot of his propaganda internally in Germany on like he was using his thought processes and like how he thought about manipulating masses in order to do a lot of the propaganda that they used in Germany.
Speaker A:So fascinating, fascinating character.
Speaker A:But just to your point, Joe, it's like he's kind of the one that started really turning society into that.
Speaker A:That want, that consumer based society in order to keep.
Speaker A:Keep spinning the wheels.
Speaker A:Thinking people, you always need more, need more, which means more money, more like more control there, the populace.
Speaker A:It was literally how he imagined it.
Speaker A:So I'm still doing a lot more research on him.
Speaker A:There's a documentary series, I think it's called A Century of Self.
Speaker A:Century of the Self.
Speaker A:It was like a BBC documentary.
Speaker A:I'll drop it into the chat.
Speaker A:I don't want to gatekeep any knowledge here.
Speaker A:So if anyone doesn't want to wait for our episode, just go watch this series and then have a hot bath afterward or something just to.
Speaker A:Just to relax because I watched the first two episodes last night and it's kind of a mind fuck a little bit.
Speaker A:But anyway, sorry.
Speaker C:We should definitely do an episode.
Speaker C:This guy's Wikipedia is unbelievable.
Speaker C:His uncle was Sigmund Freud.
Speaker C:His great nephew is Mark Randolph, who is the first CEO of Netflix.
Speaker C:The money just keeps.
Speaker C:It doesn't trickle down.
Speaker C:It just like follows the family.
Speaker C:Like just trace the lineage of this.
Speaker C:I wish there were a website where you could find the current 1% person and see their family tree and just see exactly how they got their money and how it's all like, you know, it just doesn't leave the family.
Speaker B:And that website would quickly become illegal, I'm sure.
Speaker C:Just like the jet.
Speaker B:Just like the.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:You know, the, the Twitter account that tracks private jets.
Speaker C:Or maybe we create it and Elon buys us out for like millions immediately.
Speaker C:You know, it's a good buyout scheme.
Speaker B:And it stays in our family.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:And then we could use the money to unravel them.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:I just dropped the Wikipedia for the Century of self and the YouTube series for that into the chats and we'll include that in the show.
Speaker A:Notes like fascinating.
Speaker A:And I've ordered all of his books, so I'm going to be reading through those before we go into the episode because we want to get a bunch of information there.
Speaker A:But yeah, essentially the father of American propaganda and the one that makes you want to buy that bigger truck because it's going to make you more of a man.
Speaker A:Or buy the.
Speaker A:Oh, is it the Lucky Strike cigarettes for women?
Speaker A:Like he was responsible for all of that like crazy, crazy stuff.
Speaker B:I watched all of Mad Men and I'm sure he was in there at some point.
Speaker B:I don't remember specifically him being a character, but I'm sure he was represented in some way.
Speaker B:Yeah, Lucky Strike was one of the accounts they worked on.
Speaker A:I think he was kind of like an inspiration for the characters on that.
Speaker A:I don't know if they did a direct one to one or if Don Draper was supposed to be kind of like him.
Speaker A:But I mean he, he, I don't think he was like mannerism wise, but like as far as what they did, like, yeah, there's a lot there.
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Speaker B:Surgeon General strongly advises not listening to us use may lead to death, hypocrisy or election to public office.
Speaker B:The last thing I have for today.
Speaker B:If you guys have anything else you want to talk about, feel free.
Speaker B:I wanted to talk briefly about the Planned Parenthood Supreme Court decision.
Speaker B:Among all the Supreme Court decisions that came out on the surface, it, I mean it is, it's about this whole cultural argument that's been going on in the US for several decades now about abortion.
Speaker B:The Supreme Court basically gave the go ahead for the state of South Carolina to deny Medicaid funding to Planned Parenthood.
Speaker B:I want to read a little bit from this Guardian article that explains at the end of the article the last four paragraphs or so that explains some of the details of the decision because I think the implications of it have to do with a lot more than just abortion.
Speaker B:I put this in the category of the four I mentioned at the beginning of the show on limits on freedom.
Speaker B:Maybe we can just talk about that.
Speaker B:Not only do does our government do abuses abroad and abuses at home and redistribute wealth from working people up to the wealthy, but they also find ways to limit our freedom and control the way we live our lives and the things we can do.
Speaker B:I'll just read from the Guardian article now.
Speaker B:It says, quote, the Thursday ruling marks a major victory for the right wing legal powerhouse Alliance Defending Freedom, which represented South Carolina in the case, and for its fellow anti abortion allies.
Speaker B:The case is part of a long standing effort by anti abortion activists to defund Planned Parenthood by cutting it out of Medicaid.
Speaker B:Of the 2.4 million people treated at Planned Parenthood each year, almost half use Medicaid.
Speaker B:The court's three liberal justices, Sonia Sotomayor, Lena Kagan and Ketanji Brown Jackson, the same three names from the other thing I read, dissented from the majority.
Speaker B: g out the Civil Rights act of: Speaker B:Jackson wrote, quote, today's decision is likely to result in tangible harm to real people.
Speaker B:At a minimum, it will deprive Medicaid recipients in South Carolina of their only meaningful way of enforcing a right that Congress has expressly granted to them.
Speaker B:And more concretely, it will strip those South Carolinians and countless other Medicaid recipients across the country of a deeply personal freedom, the ability to decide who treats us at our most vulnerable.
Speaker B:Reproductive rights supporters also decried the Thursday ruling.
Speaker B:Jennifer Driver, who's a senior director of reproductive rights at State Innovation Exchange, said, quote, today's decision is a direct attack on reproductive health care and it is a dangerous green light for politicians to target any providers they don't like.
Speaker B:This ruling will deepen health inequities, strip people of their basic freedom to choose, and put basic services like birth control, cancer screenings and STI testing further out of reach, unquote.
Speaker B:And so the reason I want to talk about this is like a limit on freedom is not only is it a limit on reproductive freedom for people with uteruses who are at risk of not just getting pregnant, but getting pregnant through rape or abuse or some way like that, also having that right taken away from them, but this ability of a person to take the state to court when the state violates their federal rights.
Speaker B:This is the bigger implication here because it's not just about reproductive health care or abortions.
Speaker B:If you have a right granted to you by the federal government and your local state violates that right, this decision is essentially saying that you don't necessarily have the right to take your state to court.
Speaker B:Neil Gorsuch wrote the majority decision.
Speaker B:He's basically saying that it would be annoying and costly for the federal government to have to produce the legal teams to handle all these cases.
Speaker B:In a bigger picture sense, if the states are violating our rights and the federal government is saying, tough deal with it, nothing we can do about it, it takes away another peaceful mechanism through which to solve these issues, because that's what the legal system is really about.
Speaker B:And in an abstract way, it's to.
Speaker B:We can settle disputes through violence, through just fighting each other and doing it that way, or we can have a court system that allows us to have a peaceful, organized, structured, fair way to settle disputes.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:And if you're in dispute with your state and you want to take your state to court at the federal government, this Supreme Court decision is basically saying, you don't.
Speaker B:Actually, we're taking that one back.
Speaker B:You don't really have that right in terms of democracy.
Speaker B:I've said this many, many times.
Speaker B:I think I mentioned it in one of our.
Speaker B:In our episode on defining propaganda.
Speaker B:I mentioned democracy as the propaganda to unpack.
Speaker B:You know, are we sure we live in a democracy?
Speaker C:Yeah, I think if you have a right and you can't enforce it or have any check in that system, it's not a right.
Speaker C:It is just.
Speaker C:Yeah, they're just words.
Speaker C:And with the.
Speaker C:I know.
Speaker C:I also read up on this.
Speaker C:It was like Casa v.
Speaker C:Montana, where they essentially said something similar to, like this patchwork kind of constitutional understanding where no longer can judges, you know, file injunctions that they don't agree with.
Speaker C:And now it's actually pretty much like localized based into their circuit area.
Speaker C:Like, we have the 9th Circuit here in Oregon, which is kind of like, you know, a West coast conglomeration.
Speaker C:And now it's like very much like patchwork Constitution.
Speaker C:Like, this applies here, but not here.
Speaker C:And I thought that this was like one of the key things that the Civil War ignited over was that we all had different understandings of the Constitution, and that's what led to the Civil War.
Speaker C:And here we have this branch of government saying, like, oh, actually, you're going to be more fractured now, and these decisions aren't going to be.
Speaker C:And you don't have these rights to challenge your states.
Speaker B:Which Supreme Court justices did you guys vote for in the Supreme Court election?
Speaker B:Just out of curiosity.
Speaker C:Yeah, term limits.
Speaker C:And get rid of Brett Kavanaugh.
Speaker B:It's a lifetime appointment, no elections.
Speaker B:Like, ha.
Speaker C:And the whole process that they go through is such a joke.
Speaker C:It's like they literally are found to be repressing information.
Speaker C:It's like the FBI did interview some women that Brett Kavanaugh went to college with.
Speaker C:I guess that's going to come out after he's confirmed.
Speaker A:I was just going to say this kind of reminds me too of our book that we're still finishing up our episodes on.
Speaker A:But just how, like, the main tool that the Southern Democrats had used in legislation for that book they were reading was to essentially make it so that the states were the ones that were enacting everything.
Speaker A:So, like, you could write whatever you want at the federal level, but the states are the ones that are responsible for it.
Speaker A:And this is just another version of that.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's saying there's no federal oversight or they can't go up all the way to like, the federal government in this scenario or the federal government's not going to, like, spend time litigating and then it just has to go back down to whatever the state's doing.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:And in terms of another point of like, Joe's wealth redistribution hurts is like these, these Supreme Court justices are extremely biased.
Speaker C:And like, take Clarence Thomas who went on like luxury vacations and gets like, RVs given to him and he doesn't excuse himself from cases where it matters.
Speaker C:It's like only years after this are we gonna find out that, that, you know, they're profiting in X way.
Speaker C:And here we are left holding the bag and it's like disenfranchised or marginalized groups are disproportionately affected by these things, like Medicaid.
Speaker C:Like they, they are on Medicaid.
Speaker C:And you're basically saying, like, oh, these people who are marginalized, you don't have rights.
Speaker C:Because really, it's not like middle class, upper class white people that are going to be challenging states rights around whether or not they enforce Medicaid laws.
Speaker C:It's just more racism.
Speaker C:And it's almost like we never decided about slavery and maybe we need to redo it.
Speaker B:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A:Wait, redo slavery?
Speaker B:Redo the decision, not redo slavery.
Speaker C:Oh, my God.
Speaker C:Redo the decision.
Speaker C:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:Happy belated Juneteenth, by the way.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, it's totally to your point too.
Speaker B:Like, I.
Speaker B:There's so many examples you can point to where rules, laws that limit people's freedoms or control the way people can behave in society because of the unequal distribution of wealth only exist for people who can't afford to pay the fine.
Speaker B:When I remember seeing news articles when Jeff Bezos was building, he like, bought some private residence in D.C.
Speaker B:and he was having it renovated for a long time.
Speaker B:But Basically just let a car sit out front and rack up like $17,000 in parking tickets, which is, you know, like a penny to him.
Speaker B:Just flick a penny at it and it goes away.
Speaker B:But no normal person can afford to do things like that.
Speaker B:And the same thing with healthcare.
Speaker B:Like people on Medicaid depend on these low cost or free services in order to access basic services for reproductive rights.
Speaker B:If you're moderately wealthy or comfortable, you can just pay a doctor whenever you want to.
Speaker B:Like I heard about, I think Mark Cuban, I don't know if you guys heard about this.
Speaker B:He like had some weird dream about like a blood clot or something wrong with his brain.
Speaker B:And like in the middle of the night just called his doctor and he got like a CAT scan within a couple of hours and was able to detect something that could have been fatal.
Speaker B:Like when you're, when you, when you got money, it doesn't matter.
Speaker B:The rules are for the peasants, they're not for you.
Speaker C:Like, yeah, I wrote a button, maybe even one of you sent it.
Speaker C:It was like Jeff Bezos had these hedges outside some house that it's like illegal to have hedges this high, but he built them and he just pays the fine every month.
Speaker C:They don't care.
Speaker C:And the fine is more than any of our salaries.
Speaker C:Okay, every month.
Speaker B:Those are all the cheerful topics I had lined up for today.
Speaker B:Any things you guys want to talk about.
Speaker A:After that?
Speaker A:Maybe this will make us feel better or worse.
Speaker A:I'm not sure.
Speaker A:Let me share something for a second.
Speaker A:This is like from I think six years ago, which tells us something about the times.
Speaker A:Are you worried about your country?
Speaker A:Do you feel like your land is being invaded by foreign intruders who want to change your culture?
Speaker A:Do you believe your way of life is under attack and are you ready to finally do something about it?
Speaker A:Then apply now to join ice.
Speaker B:ISIS fighting to make a difference.
Speaker A:ISIS protecting our values and beliefs.
Speaker A:ISIS rooting out the foreign enemy.
Speaker B:ISIS terrorizing the invaders.
Speaker A:ISIS attacking when they least expect.
Speaker A:ISIS blowing up the status quo.
Speaker B:I joined to be part of a.
Speaker A:Group of like minded individuals really devoted to a cause.
Speaker B:I joined after I watched some badass videos online.
Speaker A:I joined because I wanted to secure the border.
Speaker A:But then I found out that's actually border patrol's job.
Speaker B:I joined to capture those Ms.
Speaker B:Thirteen animals who are infesting America.
Speaker B:I haven't seen any yet, but I've heard about them.
Speaker A: on dating all the way back to: Speaker A:So slightly younger than that curly haired kid On Stranger Things.
Speaker A:Gaten Matarazzo.
Speaker A:That sounds Italian.
Speaker A:We're not deporting those guys yet.
Speaker B:I'm Homeland Security Secretary Kirsten Nielsen.
Speaker B:It's popular nowadays to say ISIS bad, but there's no better representation of American values right now than isis.
Speaker B:And as an equal opportunity employer, we accept all levels of experience and education, from low to very low, and actively welcome those with diagnosed anger issues.
Speaker B:I wanted to join the regular police, but they told me they wouldn't take someone who was already under arrest.
Speaker A:Arrest?
Speaker A:Animal Control said, nope.
Speaker A:The TSA rejected me because I kept asking if there was something called sky jail.
Speaker A:Is there.
Speaker A:I got kicked out of my neighborhood watch because I threw a microwave at a kid.
Speaker B:And we love that.
Speaker B:Join us today and you too can tell your ISIS story.
Speaker A:ISIS waging war for everything that's holy in this country.
Speaker A:I guess you could call it a holy war.
Speaker A:ISIS guaranteeing my ticket to heaven.
Speaker B:Take it from me, no organization is better than isis.
Speaker B:Isis.
Speaker A:I don't know if that made you guys feel better or not, but made me laugh a little bit.
Speaker A:And also.
Speaker B:Yeah, I hate how long it took me to figure out it was fake.
Speaker B:I think it was after, like, the fifth or sixth repetition of isis.
Speaker B:It's like, wait, wait a minute.
Speaker A:Hold on, hold on a second.
Speaker A:Yeah, that was.
Speaker A:Was a break with Michelle Wolf.
Speaker A:That was.
Speaker A:I think it's still on Netflix.
Speaker A:But yeah, it was one of the.
Speaker A:The clips from that.
Speaker A:And yeah, I think that was six years ago when that came out.
Speaker A:So I don't know what that says about the times, like, the masks and stuff.
Speaker A:I don't know if that was a thing then as much as it is now.
Speaker B:But, yeah, that's also what makes me feel kind of weird about our ads sometimes.
Speaker B:Like, they're fun to do and they're funny and everything, but every now and then I'm just like, this is gonna be exactly like some real thing.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And that's kind of the point of satire.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:Satire is such a subtle.
Speaker B:Like, it can slip past people, you know, like.
Speaker B:Like think, for example, Team America, World Police, that movie.
Speaker B:How many people in the.
Speaker B:Even in the Marine Corps, who on the one hand think that movie is great and funny and hilarious and feel like they get it, and then on the other hand, are gung ho about all of the same rhetoric it's making fun of, you know, I don't know.
Speaker B:The satire is a subtle thing that I'm kind of on the fence about sometimes.
Speaker A:One update, I.
Speaker A:I've got I did the interview, the one on one interview.
Speaker A:So like, I think we talked about this in like very early episodes with the, the Run for something.
Speaker A:Bernie did like a call for volunteers that were interested in either campaign helping.
Speaker A:And so I followed that process all the way through to the point where you basically do a one on one interview with a run for Something volunteer.
Speaker A:I just wanted to give a little update for anyone that was thinking about doing that process.
Speaker A:I would highly recommend, if you have any interest whatsoever, to at least take the process to that point because I think like, at that point you get a lot of really good, like, materials.
Speaker A:They, they will hook you up with people in your area that would have the best idea in the general political atmosphere for that area.
Speaker A:So they'll connect you with advocates, a bunch of resources afterwards.
Speaker A:And then it's from that point it's really on you.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Like if you say like, yep, I want to keep, keep going with this, then you got to put in effort and make that decision.
Speaker A:But I would say at least up to that point, there's no risk there.
Speaker A:It's all good information and it makes you think a little bit about yourself because there's just a couple things that you gotta, like, fill out as far as thinking through.
Speaker A:Like, you know, what would I actually care about?
Speaker A:Like, what are the issues that I think are important to me?
Speaker A:So, yeah, that's just a little plug, I would say, for, you know, run for something.
Speaker A:Go on there, see what their next intakes are, if that's something you have any interest in at all.
Speaker A:And I would highly encourage to follow through at least until that moment to really get an idea of what they've got to offer.
Speaker C:I tried and they never got back.
Speaker C:Yeah, I read that they were like inundated with a ton of people though.
Speaker C:So the other thing, you know, positive news is Zoran won the New York primary and it's a huge win against the real estate PAC and the American Israel PAC, AI PAC that gave Cuomo like 20 something million dollars.
Speaker C:And they're already talking about maybe whatever Republican tactics they have, but it should be a really interesting election and here's hoping.
Speaker A:Nice.
Speaker B:Yeah, Democrats are actually just going to be Republicans in New York City this fall and they're going to say, oh, no, no, no, he's not the real Democratic.
Speaker B:No, no, no, we're actually Republicans now.
Speaker A:I thought Cuomo was just going to run as an independent.
Speaker B:Probably.
Speaker C:Yeah, he probably will.
Speaker C:It'll probably siphon off a large percentage and it's their whole strategy.
Speaker A:Good example right.
Speaker A:Like if it makes it all the way through.
Speaker A:Like it does great things for ranked choice voting shows the value there and then also like shows that you can run a progressive campaign and and win convincingly.
Speaker B:Rooting for New York though, People can do it.
Speaker B:That's it for this week's episode.
Speaker B:Thanks so much for listening and hanging out with us.
Speaker A:If you enjoy the show, help us spread the word.
Speaker A:Leave a rating or review and share it with your friends, family, or anyone who would get something out of these conversations.
Speaker C:Your ratings, reviews and shares help this show grow.
Speaker C:And the more people listening, the harder it is for Propaganda to watch win.
Speaker B:So until next time, stay aware, stay.
Speaker C:Safe, and remember, Propaganda loves you.
Speaker A:Sam.
